Well. Interesting developments since I wrote this in September.Originally Posted by DaveL485 in September
It's being expedited now though. I think, to refer back to another recent post, the Titanic just hit the iceberg.
As we plummet towards the icy waters, I do wonder to myself whether I should bolt for the small lifeboat of Adey's new forum, or start patching the large hole in the hull.
You do know that the film titanic is floored. There was plenty of room on the drift wood for him and the woman at the end.
In a bitter irony , when put to vote the 21toc decided AGAINST joining the RTOC at the end of November.
Mate you've restricted me but I'm mearly the creator of the site, I haven't sent out any messages or anything? The only thing I have personally done was change my location, don't worry one of you cm's did the same. Posting screen shots from my site could be classed as intellectual property thus I will look into it further on my site. So basically you have restricted my access for no other reason than I run a site that I set up at the weekend?
The committee felt that getting in touch with Rich Russell to try and gain permission to take our Articles to use on your site was reason enough.
i did nothing of the sort!!!!!! can you prove this accusation. I am actually gob smacked!
I would post my response on RTOF but youve banned me. sorry.
Oh, me too.
That's the kind of forum you're wanting then
now thats just childish, its an rtoc issue and should be discussed here, i expected more from you tbh. id also msg you here privately but i cant.
indeed i have for theft
What a load of crap the committee need to give there head a wobble ,this has all come off certain people in the committee how are jealous of events over the last year and seen the arse , and the people who are getting a hard time or sh,it of the committee are real members of this club who have been to events ,organised events more than the committee.
It's a free world and if some one wants to start another page or go to meet with friends then be it , nothing to do with rtoc or committee , try running the club is instead of crying over members and other web pages.
And I bet other members will agree , that's my 2pence worth.
no i dont want people steeling from my site, i dont do it here? morbo has also for trying to incite an inter forum slagging matchOh, me too.
That's the kind of forum you're wanting then
OK Adey, I will answer your question. You say you set up the other site as a bit of fun or to show it could be done easily ?? Really? then why suddenly start to promote the site aggressively ?
You have advertised it/promoted it on here, directly & in-directly through others (& some not in a good way.)
Now you say someone tampered with your PM's, stinks to me my friend
It's sad to see core members of RTOC starting a coup against this site.
This is all because of some stirrers IMO.
I'm going to say this now as I personally see it.
Dave I feel has had an agenda, Andy is possibly just a follower, or really clever not to look like a ring leader, for a start I would ban Dave. Don't get me wrong, we do need some say in the matter on here but this has gone way, way beyond that. People give up their free time to be on the committee etc. & for what ?? To be abused & accused of things.
It started by attacking committee members & has now undermined any confidence members new & old have in the way the site is run, so they have won, for now, it will take months if not longer to rebuild the reputation of RTOC, if it can be saved at all, I personally hope it can.
People want to change the committee, why, give good reasons from way before all this started, I bet you can't find many real reasons before all this sh1t started & how many of you are there exactly from the total membership ???
What roles need changing & why, I'm not going to be a hypocrite here, I for one say Miller needs to be more active or needs replacing, so who else & why ?
What exactly did I steel (sic)?no i dont want people steeling from my site, i dont do it here? morbo has also for trying to incite an inter forum slagging match
all that other crap has no place in this threadOK Adey, I will answer your question. You say you set up the other site as a bit of fun or to show it could be done easily ?? Really? then why suddenly start to promote the site aggressively ?
where did i say that?
You have advertised it/promoted it on here, directly & in-directly through others (& some not in a good way.)
No i have not
Now you say someone tampered with your PM's, stinks to me my friend
No they did, but i like how your trying to twist it as if it was some staged event
It's sad to see core members of RTOC starting a coup against this site.
thats not whats going on here, ive just banned a member for trying to start an inter forum slagging match
This is all because of some stirrers IMO.
I set up the site off my own back with another member on here, nothing to do with any of the others that have been blocked warned or whatever
But that's apparently what all the fuss is about Adey.
You have members PMing others, blatently posting up about the other site, lso where did you live until it was changed
I'm not twisting anything, just stating a fact, just like you did, except sh1t sticks
As far as I'm aware Adey lives in Endor?
Do you control the members here? Because being adults they do what they like
And without so much as a warning or message! For information that is not what I was trying to do, it's not my way.morbo has also for trying to incite an inter forum slagging match
We have had contact from a different member of RTOF who has said they contacted Rich. But this was done on your request to upload articles to your site.
What is really need is somebody to cast an eye over the committee... To check what there doing, to be able to read the forums, and to make sure the committee have rules and they are enforced...
Organisational abuse?? The members need to feel safe and protected....
Recently I feel a lot off us have lost confidence in the committee as a whole....
We haven't seen anything good come from the committee recently...
Takes an age to get anything sorted....
We need a mass email sent out for an election,..
*Should the club go back to 1-3 people in charge (if so who wants that job?)
*Should the committee continue as they are
*Should we get re-elect current committee members, have others apply for the roles??
*Club rules could do with an update.... Nothing in the rules about contacting members to offer them a new website for events... And yet 3 people so far have had their accounts restricted.
Ivory towers have been built and need knocking down now!
It's a car forum FFS not an excuse to get high and mighty with your CM title!
Big change required simple to see, or this bitter taste will stay and RTOC will struggle to recover.
Bring back Rach or Bruce!!!!!
Steve,
Now stuff just got personal.
A follower I am not. Really Clever ? I am good at what I do. Thats IT. More specifically I have a wide knowledge of physical and virtual platforms, scripting and basic ( which could possible be epic depending on your knowledge ) of networking.
I have been around and in the Renault scene for many , many a year. Not as long as some of the old boys ( and girls if they are out there still ? ) I see a series of questions constantly be raised and asked. They have been closed / moved / locked just about every time and I asked myself why.
I have experience of running a board. I took some major flack from members when I updated a server from vbulletin1.something or other and migrated it to a more current version ( at the time ) so I know what its like. Do you know how much I charged , or made from that ? £0. It was nothing. I did it because I wanted to put something back into the club, back into the scene if you like.
Now , I have watched the club fall away through lack of members and exposure. The 21turbo was never particularly loved or desired in the UK. The club is now a small free board. We have enought brass to keep going for maybe 5 years with no upgrades.
You still reading ? Ill carry on anyway.
I can see the same things happening here as I could the 21toc. With the exception of locks / bans / breakaways.
I asked a few questions. They were locked. The committee has / had their reasons for locking. I dont agree with them.
I also took note from several older members that things have been amiss for a while ( bearing in mind I have ben here 8+ years )
The thing that is constant is that people are unhappy with various things. They might not say anything on the boards , but I hear it. Some do say things on the boards and are met with closed doors.
I have no issue with the committee as people, hell I know Romil and Lee personally. I have spoken to Chris several times , and Ross. Well Ross lives in Grimsby but lets not hold that against him.
I have spoken to IanS. I dont agree with him on lots of things. However, crucially I do value what he does for the club and its a thankless task.
Collectively though as a unit I feel that the hierarchy is flawed for several reasons. I think that key decisions are made by people , and expected to be backed up by the committee rather than thrown out to a vote to us , the paying people who pay for the upkeep.
I also think the hierarchy should be voted in and not recruited from inside.
So to sum up. I have no grand aspirations to lead the club , or follow Dave into a position of power.
I want to see the club progress , stay open in terms of respecting its members and keep posts that might criticise open otherwise you end up in a fuedal state and that isnt good for either the members or the committee.
I dont think ethically what Steve has done in terms on PM is a good move , I might have used a chinese whisper , or as the young uns call it a viral system to get some publicity over on RTOF. However , crucially I also think its a bit dodgy how Steve left all of a sudden. Something went on there. Shame, I had time for Steve and he put a lot of bloody hard work in this place too. And, its a crucial and , said hello to me at my first meet.
So there SteveL. Shame you thought that. I hope I have dispelled the myth that I am a follower , or that I am a leader.
I am an innovator , developer and evolutionary genius
( see GiraffeIT.com for evidence. )
Now play me off Johnny
Last edited by andybond; 09-01-2014 at 23:41. Reason: typo , grammar , general literacy.
I do not, I don't wish to either, I just want RTOC to go back a bit & take a look at what nonsense this all is, but alas, it has gone way to far for this. People are going to leave, people will be banned & people will stay, the people that stay will rebuild this site, do you want to be one of the people that stay, or go ?
Obviously i don't have much say in this as i personally don't have lot's of experience of the past but i do have to say i'm genuinely surprised this is so drastic!
So let me do my say as an "outsider", i guess people (general speaking) are being spoiled by what we have. Ofcourse i'm guilty too this to as we live in an environment which is awsome to say the least.
What happens here (although less drastic) is something i've seen many times on the dutch forums. That's exactly why i've completely lost interest into posting shit about my own projects. Which is a shame ofcourse as i love to read and discuss interesting matter in other peoples topics.
I have to admit from the second i read the post about Sangliers being on a different forum is the moment i considered signing up for it. Purely cause besides considering this as the most knowledgeable forum regarding old Renault turbo's this is also a place to keep contact with people.
Because the only people i've really met irl and had loads of fun with are the ones going to Sanglier so that's something i don't want to miss out on.
I personally never had problems here but that's probably cause i don't go back that much and also don't understand 80% of your jibber jabber cause it's not my language of nature.
So please all who have issues gather with eachother and play open cards with eachother, don't be too stuborn to admit your faults and try to settle with eachother.
I know whe're all men probably with stuborn minds but in the end this (+ other maybe) forum has brought us all together to what we are now.
Cheers for reading the whole story if you did, hope it has helped!
Arthur
At the minute mate , I think a lot will answer not bothered and that is crucial
That made me laugh.
Andy, with all that's gone on, & is going on, if you are indeed sincere in all you say I openly offer an apology. Sorry, it just kills me to see RTOC fall apart like this.
Because I changed my take on it and warned everyone off, openly on the thread I started suggesting it and changed my own vote after I was appalled at the treatment I received here.
Shame, it would have worked well for all parties. For the record though, I would promote it again if this place turned around.
With all this going on it's for the good of the site at the moment, when the dust has settled in a few day I will review my decisions
Steve, you still got my number ?
There is no hard feeling at all. I am genuine and sincere in this honestly. I think RTOC needs some tough love and it will fix itself.
Is that aimed at me?
[if so]
What in the actual **** have I done now?
I'm not that sorry you bleedin northerner
Well I don't plan on going anywhere unless I'm forced too, this thread was about someone going into my profile and switching off my messaging, it's gone way further than that. I'm still none the wiser as to who did it yesterday. I'm all for rtoc I wouldn't pay membership for 11 years otherwise.
It's not like I have previous for inciting riots on here, I've never had a warning to my name that I know of either. I set up a quiet place to talk about cars and that's it.
Right you witch hunter you. I think I still have yours....I'm not that sorry you bleedin northerner
No one cares...
In defense of Adey.
I set the site up. Had no intention to do anything with it, I was just going to populate the basic structure and then screen grab it and post on here to show my 30 mins work. It was dormant for about a few days and then Adey found the site/me.
My initial thought was that If the club was interested they could have used the site and told all members to shift across to the new site, Scoff clearly got upset by this and I just thought you know what why waste my time. I've only been here 5 minutes. Proboards costs nothing to host unless you want/need upgraded features, the free features are more than you could ever need anyway and I was considering the clubs cashflow at the same time. The clubs poor hosting provider that goes up and down, and all the other stuff that new members see here on a daily basis.
Adey suggested a new name as I had chosen RTOC, like I said it was done for the club. This is when he suggested RTOF and that he would do some work on the site. I deleted the RTOC site and setup RTOF from scratch. The members who had already found it were asked to move across and they did so.
That's about it.
So you were banned from Adeys forum? without so much as a warning? no PM to let you know?
Sounds like a good old fashioned dictatorship... What were you just saying penfold about The members need to feel safe and protected.... Is that how you feel on RTOF?
Most of the crap lately stems from you, or posts on threads started by you, or you posting on threads... & you seem to feel singled outIs that aimed at me?
[if so]
What in the actual **** have I done now?
& won't you be trying to merge 21OC with RTOF, pretty sure I read a post just now stating something like that... since you are a moderator on there...
While you're there ask him why he wants to ban me will ya
As I am the supreme overlord on 21TOC , Ill decide when and if we merge. I just need to speak to Chairman Mao ( Craig ) and we then suggest to the minions via a poll which way they want to go.Most of the crap lately stems from you, or posts on threads started by you, or you posting on threads... & you seem to feel singled out
& won't you be trying to merge 21OC with RTOF, pretty sure I read a post just now stating something like that... since you are a moderator on there...
If they want to merge , we merge.
If not we wont.
Simple really.
Until the RTOF is large enough to have an influence in some way shape or form I doubt there will be a merger.
No, I think you'll find I vocalised my issues as many did and I was singled out by Ian because he thinks i'm someone else. I defended myself in kind and [snowball]. The last time he attacked me was when I asked Scoff for his opinion on cylinder head flow around valves FFS!!!Most of the crap lately stems from you, or posts on threads started by you, or you posting on threads... & you seem to feel singled out
& won't you be trying to merge 21OC with RTOF, pretty sure I read a post just now stating something like that... since you are a moderator on there...
And no, that post on RTOF was a suggestion to merge the 9/11/21/25 forums on the site itself together, as there isnt enough cars left to warrant individual forums even if every single car owner were registered. Please re-read my thread, Adey misinterpreted it initially. I just thought a 9/11/21/25 incorporated forum made more sense than individual ones.
Indeed.
Agree with you mate , the committee needs sorting out ,and it's leadership , club events and everything else.
Do you know what events the club organised last year matt? Which ones did you attend?
ChildSo you were banned from Adeys forum? without so much as a warning? no PM to let you know?
Sounds like a good old fashioned dictatorship... What were you just saying penfold about The members need to feel safe and protected.... Is that how you feel on RTOF?
Nope, inter forum slagging isn't tolerated and is stated but we don't have the same rules as here and you don't pay for the service, all decisions will be reviewed as I have said here and if you would like to contact me I'm sure you can get hold of my number. Nothing will be done untill the dust settles
Mmmm yes but to be honest like many on here I am sick to death of both "sides" on here, people are bringing their own agenda's to the table and not being big enough to put those aside and fight for the benefit of the club.So you were banned from Adeys forum? without so much as a warning? no PM to let you know?
Sounds like a good old fashioned dictatorship... What were you just saying penfold about The members need to feel safe and protected.... Is that how you feel on RTOF?
Broadly I am supportive of the club and committee though I now see there has to be change and it needs to be seen to be done. I am massively disappointed with some of the members whom I had some respect, shame on you.
You cant go that far and not name ?
I named names in my rant. I said I dont agree with IanS on things. People need to have conviction in what they are saying instead of pussyfooting around.
Ashy, I give Adey's website 3-6 months max.... If RTOC gets sorted....So you were banned from Adeys forum? without so much as a warning? no PM to let you know?
Sounds like a good old fashioned dictatorship... What were you just saying penfold about The members need to feel safe and protected.... Is that how you feel on RTOF?
How ever if there are no changes on rtoc I can imagine Adey's website to survive and to be well used.
Adey built the website one weekend (I built a pmt trackday in one evening ), which I invited people on RTOC to use whilst rtoc was on and offline a lot... Once rtoc got online my pmt track day one didn't get used.... The same could well happen to Adey's website and I am sure Adey and other members on there would be happy if RTOC improves and changes....
Tit for tat ATM, what really needs to happen is an open dialogue, miller to call Adey, restrictions to be removed, nobody needs to apologise... Just move one for the greater good...
RTOC has been apart of my life for 11 years, which is over a 3rd of my life, I don't want to see it go and I am sure most of us on here & Adey's website think the same....
We just need change, hopefully that will bring improvements....
Most likely some change will happen, and same old sh*t will happen next year... Truth is we are all grumpy old men over the winter because we don't use our toys as much...
He can call me too.
Lmao!
Andy will call you.
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